fair?

Comments

This is an information dense age - there's a lot of it about, and I suspect most of us do not have the time, nor the inclination, to dig deep. Plus, you can't fix stupid.

If one had to check all the sources used before commenting on a Vox post, there would be little of it around.

But, hey - it makes for interesting reading!

You said, " the principles above (and many more) apply not only to Science but wherever a point is being made."

Whoa! Are you suggesting that there are NOT lots of topics, lots of cultures, lots of communities, lots of discourse types and lots of conversational agendas? Are you suggesting that the huge variety of types of conversation should ALL be subject to the same rules? To YOUR rules?

Every context has its own rules, whether you like it or not. Every conversation, every speech community, is going to assume some rules and then break some rules and then change some rules. To say all talk has to be subject to some dogmatic logic of science (as stated by you) is to deny the validity of how MOST of the people in the world talk about most things.

That is a whole lot of denial, isn't it?

The principles above are very general and can be applied when someone is giving their own point of view on something. I mention science because science has the best methods of analysis.

I never founded these principles, if can even call them that. It just outlines a way of analysis and a lot of people do that anyway. I am not suggesting 'there are NOT lots of topics, lots of cultures, lots of communities, lots of discourse types and lots of conversational agendas', but that there should be more.

'Are you suggesting that the huge variety of types of conversation should ALL be subject to the same rules? To YOUR rules?' I don't consider these rules, but i call for objectivity and good evidence based reasoning. i'm sure that's not controversial. These ideas seem to very vague so it doesn't befit anything in particular. I mention science because it's a prime example of evidence based reasoning.

I do not consider them dogmatic, becuase they call for people to think for themselves and reason in the first place, so what i'm saying is rather the opposite. I don't deny how most of the world talk about most things, becuase discussing ideas in general is good. To be honest is a rant on journalists who don't back a lot of what they say with hard evidence and usually ends up being opinion. If the journalists are less partisan, then people aren't fed with this partisan opinion politics so people aren't required to go out of their way to discover the real facts and the story. None the less, people shouldn't research each article they read, but like i say, if the governmets taking the country to war, then people should research the sources and evidence. I f the journalists did their job right, this wouldn't be required of people.

i'm pretty sure i never said anything controversial there. maybe i wasn't clear enough?



In science (this is what defines it) you must be objective (as possible), and use facts (which ones?) and logic (which kind?). Great. No problem with applying those standards to that field.

Other types of discourse have other rules, all of which are constructed by the communities in which they function.

I hope, Mr Nice, that you are not suggesting here that poets, preachers, mystics, therapists, coaches, music critics, neighbors, salespeople, motivational speakers and advertising copywriters all follow the same rules as scientists?

Since I usually go further, I could go further here, to suggest that the rules of evidence and argumentation VARY between sciences. Get some geologists and linguists together over lunch to talk about psychology and you will quickly find out that what is acceptably scientific for one group is not for the other group.

[this is good]

Your suggestions that people think objectively is usually good advice.

There are other ways, however, to read and think critically, apart from objectivity. Like examining the logic and structure of an argument. Usually that is a QUICKER way to sort out good stuff from bad stuff.

m

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Mr.Nice

About Me

Mr.Nice
United Kingdom
I'm smart enough to know that I'm dumb.